Nice to see some more replies here. I will try and address most points quickly:
Rotted
Judging from the way you describe yourself in forums (interests, quotes seems to be a mix of hell/metal/Satanism/few Nietzche random rants), I find it a bit hard to take what you seriously. You either are a true Satanist, in which case you adore pretty much what personifies evil in everything, no matter if it exists or not, or you are pretending to be for the sake of dissing on Christianity. I very much doubt you are into sacrificing virgins, children and drinking blood, so I will assume the second. In that case, please try to read my posts again without being blinded by your hate against Christians. Then, realize that even though I will not go into what religion is again, and discus history with you, I will again repeat the fact that you are falling victim to stereotyping again. I will try and make an analogy, since that usually is easier to get the point across. I am not sure where you are from, but assume for a second you are german. I might say then that german have killed millions and millions in both first and second world ward in just one century (not even going into millennia span), so from now on I hate your guts because you are german.
Yes, there have been many “religious” people that have killed and slayed past and present, as there have been countless “un-religious” others doing the same, as there also have been countless “religious” people helping millions of people and humanity in general. Any attempt to categorize all Christians, or muslim, jewish or any other religious/non religious people for that matter into one bad individual that is a member of, is completely foolish behaviour. It is simply spiritual racism, instead of physical one. Since I yet have to see a real argument from you, I will ignore your Christian hate mongering comments and hope you will see the light at some point.
Uzi
I understand that you were drunk or whatever, what I don’t understand is how in that state of mind you can think of posting anything of value into a real discussion. I am sure 10 years later from now you will not do the same mistake, hence the grow up comment, which I think is still valid. I am not imposing anything, in fact my post are completely against that if you took the time to actually read them, I am simply pointing the complete failure of the argument you are trying to make. Your new “Someone thought God made heat, now we now it’s the sun, hence all beliefs/religion are bs” is again completely illogical, I’d suggest logic books/courses if you can’t see that. Following your reasoning, teh fact that scientists thought there was no particle smaller than an atom a hundred years ago, means all science is bs now. Also, going along the lines what mush said, I tried to ignore as much as I could from your post, but your end line was certanly a bit striking, and you are doing the same now that you are apparently “sober”, just goes to show your mindset. I guess next time I will just have to skip your post completely
Rich
You are I think one of the few people that I was actually hoping to get some comments from, since I knew I wasn’t going to get some casual rant based on nothing, so let me try and go through what you question.
Again, I would like to stress the point of not identifying God with religion, especially what “religion” is now in modern times, refer to my previous points. As you said, there are many different religious beliefs, present and past, and they simply reflect the psychological/spiritual state of the people at the time, or their life philosophy, it has nothing to do with the fact that God exists.
Having said that, you raise the issue of homosexuality. This is a very important issue, especially now in US (and gradually elsewhere too). While I feel this deserves its own thread, I will comment shortly on it on general personal view. Yes, I believe that is an abomination, and while someone might think that means an evil, terrible thing that must be annihilated at once, to me it simply means it’s a sickness, un-natural thing that can be healed and cared for. I do not think anybody can argue that behavior is natural, you simply have to look at all aspects of life around you to understand that. Sadly, now it seems if someone can afford to sponsor a campaign to make something, no matter its purpose, as simply “a right to do”, and people love to blame anything they apparently have no control of (birth, genes, blood….) to justify their actions to get rid of responsibility, we are witnessing the gradual decay of all ethical/social values. There have already been groups asking recognition of sex between adults and children, man and animals and all other sick stuff, and there is more to come. This is what happens when complete moral disarray exists. I would gladly explore this more on its own thread.
Now going back to this concept of “following rules” you reference repeatedly. Again, assuming you read my previous posts, I will try to not repeat my point, but will shortly summarize some stuff. The bible, like any other book that doesn’t simply state facts, is something is understood, interpreted and reflected upon according to your state of mind/beliefs, and making the required adjustments from any insights and knowledge newly acquired. It is not a book that is just read. Therefore, we (man) are not dismissing some text, or negating another, or imposing some other. We are simply walking the path of the spiritual journey, as have millions of others before us, and countless others after. In the perspective, consider the bible has challenged our beliefs for millennia, and trust me, you can’t address all of humanity issues in one chapter
Hence, depending on human generations and philosophy, there are always different parts in the bible that call out to people. 100 years from now, some passage that to us seems a mystery, might simply be a common stating of a fact. This is what all this “taking out of context” is referring to. Believe it or not, there are still societies right now that live by Moses law or some similar fashion, and it happens to be the best one that makes sure they don’t massacre each other.
I can take any old book dealing with past issues, and make up some analogy in the present and try to apply to it the same rules as in the past, resulting in some absurd situation. While this works great as a laugh (don’t most stand-up comedians do a very similar thing), it is out of the question to consider it a reality.
Going to your third point which again touches on a similar theme that I already addressed quite a bit on my previous posts, the whole “Who are we to decide how to live life if there is a god ….” I am sure you have wondered as to the reason of existence, why we are here. I surely see no point whatsoever in our life if that is simply a page on a book and all we do is read it aloud as we live our life. Again, existence of God doesn’t mean we are all of a sudden a bunch of robots following our programming. It is our intelligence and decision-making ability that makes us unique from anything else in this planet, and un-fortunately it comes with a very heavy price too, the ability to choose wrong instead of right (and ultimately death), but the very fact that we understand that is the most amazing concept in this universe, and I actually see that as one of the main reason why God exists to be able to create that in us. I certainly see no resemblance to it in any fashion on anything material surrounding us.
Regarding your comments on the modern writings in religion, sadly I agree with you, a lot of philosophers now tend to complicate and make things more confusing instead of getting to the bottom of very basic questions, thinking that the more complicated they make it, the “better” the understanding of it is. This is one of the reasons I am still a big fan of old greek philosophy and its followers. It sounds to me, and you in fact stated it yourself, that you are quite confused on this whole matter. I certainly hope I helped a bit, but I would gladly encourage you to make you own research on the matter, hopefully something you will afford doing during your entire life, discuss with people from both camps, and contact me personally too with any questions. I believe any discussions on these matters benefit people no matter if their point is proven right or wrong. Looking forward to your feedback
Mush
As I said, I had the same feeling from his posts, so good to see others feel the same way
