The Dutch Situation atm...

[BRaiNRaiN]

I'm getting tired of this entire situation already. After Van Gogh's murder the country changed alot in my opinion and it feels like it's only get worse and worse in a rapid speed. Mosques and muslim schools are being lit and so are churches.

And in my opinion the worst thing of all is that Geert Wilders (A dutch right-winged politician) is using Van Gogh's dead for his own popularity. A few days after Van Gogh's dead he decides to form his own political party, which is imo quite strange as he has been treatened by extremists himself and went underground for some days. He knows that this country is upset by what happened and he knows that he would get alot of votes now if there were any elections.
In my opinion its absolutely the wrong time to form ur own political party, or am i wrong?

Do you think this is going to stop soon or are we on the edge of a civil war? And who's responsible for this all? The government (which hardens the entire society), the extremists or someone else ?

(Ps. sorry for my grammar)

 

[IceDragon]

ye indeed, it seems to me like you are up to get an alliance with Bush to chase muslims

dunno, but a little time ago, a bomb exploded in a muslim school (was in the belgian news )

I was kinda thinking: "fuck, this can only get worse "

You seem to confirm that tendencies


dunno what else to say


live in peace, don't kill noone, and if you wanna kill, play ut 2k4, or if you have a shit pc , play UT

 

[BRaiNRaiN]

lol! no way i'm going that way..
As u could propably conclude from my post above, there is no way im going to vote for this right winged party of Geert Wilders or any right winged party, because imo that will only make the situation worse and worse coz they want to solve this by force and by doing that u only generate more hate among the muslim society in my opinion. The only right way to solve this is by accepting each others religions and sepperate the good from the bad people. Not just Muslims extremists but also christian extremists.

 

[ProPain]

i would approve of harsher rules and i would hope they did something about muslim mosques preaching about jihad in the netherlands. (which is what they do now) but what he is trying to do is completely over the top.

In harsh times the climate for wannabe hitlers is perfect and they will get a lot of shockvotes but it is quite important to keep your head cool. I myself hope he doesnt get any frigging votes cos all we need now is a a rightwing nutter to make things worse. Atm the atmosphere in the netherlands is really bizarre, i heard some rigthwing scumbag on the radio preeching to ppl about taking up arms to disable the muslim threat. Together with the raid in the hague it is worrying to see what the future will bring for us.

 

[sneez]

You can't really blame anyone for this kind of happenings. It's a long process wich can't be solved in a few days. I can't give you any solutions for this whole problem aswell.

Anyway a lil offtopic now. I was helping a friend of mine with her History lessons. (About world war I and II).
It were 2 wars in a short period of time. (And we're still in that short period).
First one was caused by a servian(spelling?) second one was caused by Hitler and Civil unrest. I'm not implenting there could be any war. Because we are more sophisticated in defending ourselfs now. BUT a civil war could be at hands by this shit :<

 

[Rob1000100]

Well I live in Hull which I belive is the racist (and possibly chav) capitol of England. There's a lot of nationalist support yet with no reason for it. While talking to some BNP supporters I found they have no reason for there stance. I have concluded that they are just thick and thus easily fall for the propaganda of nationalists (conservative proaganda is too complex for them). In Hull if your skin colour is anything other than white or fake tan orange then you are an asylum seeker.

Alot of the current situation has been ensighted by the media just by one sided storys and selective broadcasting...
A quick example - 300 palestinians peacefully protest against Israel in the US each protester represented a child that had been killed in the conflicts. 2 extreamists came along, nothing to do with the protest and burnt the Israeli flag, later on the news "300 palestinians protest against Israel by burning the Israeli flag" the pictures shown were of the flag burners.

The best thing you can do is be anti-racist, if a m8 blames all the "asylum seekers" for the problems, then argue with him. Oh and vote for the non extreamists

 

[Sudeki`]

IMO its a bit their own fault(the dutchies). 1 they let the muslims do EVRYTHING in this country.. build mosques, start an AEL(some weird thingy for moslims) wear those weird clothes when they go to work. and allot of other stuff. you gotta draw the line somewhere.

like PP said, they are preaching bout Jihad in the netherlands. y not shut those mosques down? so they learn their lesson fs.
i mean has any1 been to a church? ever? well i've been. if you hear that guy that preaches(dont know what he's called in english) you can hear a kind voice, atleast i do. and when i hear those imams on tv, its as if they are forcing you to do stuff.

common, you should do summat about these things or holland will only get worse!

(soz for typo's and grammer)

 

[ProPain]

i wonder how ppl would react if we had churches which told us to go on crusades
I think if such things happends dutch politicians would shut it down and the pope would drool some lones along the way of "dont listen to those fools".

I am perfectly fine with muslims in the netherlands, but now they are warning us for jihad, and if the dutch ppl wont behave according to their rules we would pay the highest price. This is really going the wrong way

 

[F@TBOY]

Hull is a prime example, we just have to get on with it and do our own thing, ignore the pricks that are trying to fuck it up for us

 

[Sudeki`]

Hull is a prime example, we just have to get on with it and do our own thing, ignore the pricks that are trying to fuck it up for us

it aint easy to ignore these things when your children can be burned down when they are @ school

 

[Rob1000100]

common, you should do summat about these things or holland will only get worse!

I think the point being made is fighting extreamists and racists with racism and extreamism just does not work. That WILL decend your country into civil war.

By the looks of your statement W@R-CHILD your one of the nationalists that has fallen for right wing propaganda. Its simple really your either a racists or not, there is no inbetween. If your a racist then your just gonna make things worse. Well cool off don't take this statement as an insult. Try to see it from both sides, like you say you have been to church... well have you been to a mosque?

What normaly happens is just before civil war the normal non extreamist people group together to help the ignorant among you catch with what is happening. Try to watch the movie American History-X...

 

[Martz]

IMO its a bit their own fault(the dutchies). 1 they let the muslims do EVRYTHING in this country.. build mosques, start an AEL(some weird thingy for moslims) wear those weird clothes when they go to work. and allot of other stuff. you gotta draw the line somewhere.

You do? I'm not even up to date on the current situation in NL, but by saying that people who have different beliefs, traditions or appearances should change to fit into your society is very harsh, and even possibly even racist. Why shouldn't they "let muslims do EVERYTHING in this country", when you are able to do everything you want in the country too. You have the right to pick a religion, worship and pray; why shouldn't every other dutch citizen?

Tolerance for other people, regardless of their religion, apperances and beliefs is whats required for peace.

like PP said, they are preaching bout Jihad in the netherlands. y not shut those mosques down? so they learn their lesson fs.
i mean has any1 been to a church? ever? well i've been. if you hear that guy that preaches(dont know what he's called in english) you can hear a kind voice, atleast i do. and when i hear those imams on tv, its as if they are forcing you to do stuff.

common, you should do summat about these things or holland will only get worse!

(soz for typo's and grammer)

I could also say the same for the Christian or Catholic religions, remove the churches since the Priest is always telling people to be pure, telling them to believe in an almighty God who is better than all of you, who will guide you and teach you how to live how your creators intended. Oh, and don't you dare think about the same gender in a loving or sexual way; for you will burn for all eternity in hell.

 

[-CrackKing-]

There's probably more religious nutcases in London (maybe the most famous being Mr. Hook from Finsbury Mosque (I think it was there??)), or maybe even Croydon where I live, than the whole of the Netherlands. I say probably, I don't know the figures. But ill preaching has been going on for years, decades, whatever. Although Holland has reason to, I don't think it should shit itself just yet. Especially as the number of extremists is quite disproportionate to the number of upstanding citizens...

 

[BRaiNRaiN]

IMO its a bit their own fault(the dutchies). 1 they let the muslims do EVRYTHING in this country.. build mosques, start an AEL(some weird thingy for moslims) wear those weird clothes when they go to work. and allot of other stuff. you gotta draw the line somewhere.

like PP said, they are preaching bout Jihad in the netherlands. y not shut those mosques down? so they learn their lesson fs.
i mean has any1 been to a church? ever? well i've been. if you hear that guy that preaches(dont know what he's called in english) you can hear a kind voice, atleast i do. and when i hear those imams on tv, its as if they are forcing you to do stuff.

common, you should do summat about these things or holland will only get worse!

(soz for typo's and grammer)

As u know Holland has always been a tollerant country to other religions and if we wouldnt let them build any mosques or religious buildings like that, then the hatred would be alot worse than it is now i think. And we cant break down mosques as we have the freedom of religion here. The good should never suffer from what the bad do.

Btw we're mainly talking about muslim fundamentalism and extremism now, but what about the christian extremists. They're just as worse imo, because they try to heaten up the situation just as much. You simply can't forget about these people because then they think, that they can do whatever they want.

IE. Today in Den Bosch, a city llike 20 kilometres from my house they put posters on walls against the muslim religion and they only do this to generate more hate and fear. They're absolutely nothing better than those muslim extremists. And the government comes with the idea to bring those muslim extremists back to there motherland, but what about these extreme right winged people that do such things? In my opinion you always have to punish them with equal proportions.

 

[ProPain]

in den bosch, thats where i live and i havent seen anything today in den bosch.
doesnt mean it didnt happen i am just curious to the source so i can check it out

as for the rest i totally agree , freedom of religion is a democratic cornerstone, i just wish the government will treat all extremists (no matter what religion they say they are) the same hopefully "harsh" way.

 

[Hector]

IMO its a bit their own fault(the dutchies). 1 they let the muslims do EVRYTHING in this country.. build mosques, start an AEL(some weird thingy for moslims) wear those weird clothes when they go to work. and allot of other stuff. you gotta draw the line somewhere.

"Weird clothes" ffs? War Child there is a strong flavour of intolerance in your posts. You'd do well to take on board what some of the other people have said on the subject in this thread before you buy into the same right wing crap that's fuelling the mob . You either listen to both sides, get informed and make a decision based on tolerance and perspective or you continue to propogate the reactionary shite of those that see violence as the immediate and only solution.

 

[Bart]

i'm a tolerant person.
I don't care if you are dutch, german, african, catholic, muslim or even an adc member , but you've to ask yourself whether muslim people allow christians in a muslim country doing the same things muslims can do here.

i.e. in turkey it's forbidden to wear head cloth ("kopftuch" in german, dunno how it's called in english), but when france didnt allow to wear such cloth anymore, muslims demonstrate.

that's strange.

 

[Martz]

i.e. in turkey it's forbidden to wear head cloth ("kopftuch" in german, dunno how it's called in english), but when france didnt allow to wear such cloth anymore, muslims demonstrate.

that's strange.

Isn't peaceful demonstration a universal right these days in most civilised countries? If you don't like something or feel that it is wrong, a demostration can draw attention to your cause. It's pretty much the only thing you can do, apart from write a letter to the Goverment official/MP etc. It's going too far when it becomes a riot and causes clashes with the police or other sorts of violence, but I don't believe that happened in France. It still got a lot of media coverage from people who said "Well I want to keep my traditions, so I am going to protest by wearing my head scarf in school, and demonstrate publically that I don't support this decision". Or something along those lines, but in French. Those are the scenes I remember from the media, I might not have seen all of the coverage - so please prove me wrong if I am!

 

[Sudeki`]

"Weird clothes" ffs? War Child there is a strong flavour of intolerance in your posts. You'd do well to take on board what some of the other people have said on the subject in this thread before you buy into the same right wing crap that's fuelling the mob . You either listen to both sides, get informed and make a decision based on tolerance and perspective or you continue to propogate the reactionary shite of those that see violence as the immediate and only solution.

like i already pointed out with IMO in my opinion i find it weird clothes.

 

[Sudeki`]

btw at same post of Hector: who said summat bout violence? i said lotta mosques make people think violence aint that bad at all.
if the politicians(or how you say that) talk bout a rule(or how you call that?) bout those things that you cant tell people violence aint bad and stuff like that, i dont c the point any1 is using violence there!