Ban Cheaters?
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tbh give them a 2nd chance...
to me theres no real alternative to it other than tempban them.
i dont like to play against caught cheater either as i always will suspect them cheating.
what would happen if we d permban them? they would leave but i honestly dont think they d leave for good, they will just create a new account and start over again. and yes good luck catching them again while they re being a lot more careful and unknown in their flawed character - i d rather have an eye on them.
and imo most ppl cheat to be accepted in the community (thats probably why many young ppl cheat).
although i despise cheaters just like any other fair player i somewhat respect them for taking the everlasting contempt of the community.
2nd time caught is a permban and i dont care if its league or pub game.
to me theres no real alternative to it other than tempban them.
i dont like to play against caught cheater either as i always will suspect them cheating.
what would happen if we d permban them? they would leave but i honestly dont think they d leave for good, they will just create a new account and start over again. and yes good luck catching them again while they re being a lot more careful and unknown in their flawed character - i d rather have an eye on them.
and imo most ppl cheat to be accepted in the community (thats probably why many young ppl cheat).
although i despise cheaters just like any other fair player i somewhat respect them for taking the everlasting contempt of the community.
2nd time caught is a permban and i dont care if its league or pub game.
who says i never cheated. And i am not proud at having two "botters" in my clan but i do agree that wish and m1c0 are two of the best Assault players in UTA and that you will never come close to their skill.
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I´ve never even been to the clanbase site i think. I just thought they have a so much better system or rules section against cheating according to what Maber mentioned in the last match report. However, you just convinced me of taking a look at it.
Clanbase system afaik just says things like permanent ban for repeat offenders, bans for cheating on public servers, bans for having traces of cheats whether in use or not, clans punished if cheat used in matches etc. Their bans are all fixed.
The only real difference as far as I can see is that they have no flexibility on cheating, ie if you used someones INI file and there was a cheat line in it like Hank said earlier then youd have a ban, no appeals. That in my opinion doesnt make it a better system, just easier for admins to implement as they dont have to worry about any comeback.
I guess the biggest problems for admins at the moment in trying to implement a 2nd offence= perm ban are that there was no system for logging bans in the past, this means that there will be some logs for some people that cheated but others that arent so well known might have been forgotten about by the public. In my opinion its then unfair to ban some for a repeat offence just because their previous offence is remembered where as others may get away with it because people dont remember them cheating. Also I dont know how well Clanbase deal with creating new accounts, its easy for them to say "we give them a perm ban for cheating" and then let them signup a new account a couple of weeks later after they change their ISP etc, in that case a perm ban is pointless.
The only real difference as far as I can see is that they have no flexibility on cheating, ie if you used someones INI file and there was a cheat line in it like Hank said earlier then youd have a ban, no appeals. That in my opinion doesnt make it a better system, just easier for admins to implement as they dont have to worry about any comeback.
I guess the biggest problems for admins at the moment in trying to implement a 2nd offence= perm ban are that there was no system for logging bans in the past, this means that there will be some logs for some people that cheated but others that arent so well known might have been forgotten about by the public. In my opinion its then unfair to ban some for a repeat offence just because their previous offence is remembered where as others may get away with it because people dont remember them cheating. Also I dont know how well Clanbase deal with creating new accounts, its easy for them to say "we give them a perm ban for cheating" and then let them signup a new account a couple of weeks later after they change their ISP etc, in that case a perm ban is pointless.
if the two ppl who voted for "Nah they deserve infinite amounts of chances." and the 4 ppl who voted for "I just don't care wether i play against cheaters or not." would have voted for "On the second offence ban them permanently." this option would have won by 1 vote
![:]](/images/smilies/block-head.gif "Blockhead :]")
2nd opntion that is.
Of my point of view and experience:
If you had permanently banned all the players who have cheated in the past, the league would now count of like 1 division and thats just StdAS. I'm not saying there are tons of ex cheaters around, well in fact there is mass of players who were banned for some sort of cheating however the times i used to be an admin we didn't announced it publically and that way people doesn't really realize how many such people are still around.
Anyway it's not the case, my point is that lots of clans would probably leave the league cause of lack of members.
Lets face it, we rarely getting new people into uta community and i believe that as Petez mentioned aspect of forgiveness is the way to go.
Some players have cheated years ago, there were like 12 yrs old then they were kids looking for a boost for their shitty skils cause they were getting owned
After a ban they have learned and i can easly point out several such players.
The permanently ban discussion coming back every year or two but before you starting getting rid of community members for 'mistake' they have made in the past think that we're not CB, we do not have 500 clans in countless number of leagues.
Im not trying to excuse anyone's cheating cause theres no excuse for that, however i can't agree with perma ban for 1st crime against uta.
Of my point of view and experience:
If you had permanently banned all the players who have cheated in the past, the league would now count of like 1 division and thats just StdAS. I'm not saying there are tons of ex cheaters around, well in fact there is mass of players who were banned for some sort of cheating however the times i used to be an admin we didn't announced it publically and that way people doesn't really realize how many such people are still around.
Anyway it's not the case, my point is that lots of clans would probably leave the league cause of lack of members.
Lets face it, we rarely getting new people into uta community and i believe that as Petez mentioned aspect of forgiveness is the way to go.
Some players have cheated years ago, there were like 12 yrs old then they were kids looking for a boost for their shitty skils cause they were getting owned
After a ban they have learned and i can easly point out several such players.
The permanently ban discussion coming back every year or two but before you starting getting rid of community members for 'mistake' they have made in the past think that we're not CB, we do not have 500 clans in countless number of leagues.
Im not trying to excuse anyone's cheating cause theres no excuse for that, however i can't agree with perma ban for 1st crime against uta.
On clanbase they impose perm ban but it doesnt work as just like MyM says they just come back under a new nick and join a new clan.
there are a number of "ex" cheaters in the iCTF community that were banned and then came back under differnt names and the admins dont re ban them they just get left to carry on even though everyone knows they are a cheat but atleast most of the top clans wont touch them or kick um out when they find out they were a cheater.
Its really easy to Ban a player from this league but it is not easy to keep them away.
you would hope that clans who have a player that has been caught cheating more than once and shows no sign of remorse or guilt for cheating would kick that player out not keep them becuase "they got skills" it doent take much skill to cheat. show some balls ffs.
there are a number of "ex" cheaters in the iCTF community that were banned and then came back under differnt names and the admins dont re ban them they just get left to carry on even though everyone knows they are a cheat but atleast most of the top clans wont touch them or kick um out when they find out they were a cheater.
Its really easy to Ban a player from this league but it is not easy to keep them away.
you would hope that clans who have a player that has been caught cheating more than once and shows no sign of remorse or guilt for cheating would kick that player out not keep them becuase "they got skills" it doent take much skill to cheat. show some balls ffs.
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it was never covered up, the previous admins didnt use name and shame for cheaters for whatever reason.
Like I said perviously the problem for new admins is that there is no written history of cheaters, some they may know but there is nothing to say what punishment was issued out or for what cheat. Brajan has introduced a publich forum for cheaters but that obviously only shows the last 6-8 months, that is the only place afaik where all previous cheaters caught are listed in one place.
Like I said perviously the problem for new admins is that there is no written history of cheaters, some they may know but there is nothing to say what punishment was issued out or for what cheat. Brajan has introduced a publich forum for cheaters but that obviously only shows the last 6-8 months, that is the only place afaik where all previous cheaters caught are listed in one place.
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