Epic finally speaks out about the future of the ut franchise...
- Thread starter Dark
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shit shit shit... and again i have to say Bart is right!
the coding in RoAR was probably decent but the mapping was pure horror, the maps were all too spammy and unbalanced. and the problem that no one plays usermods isnt with epics support, if a mod is good then ppl will play it, if it isnt then nobody will. theres not much more epic could do. mod support from a game company is basicly down to how easy their game is to mod, they cant promotote the mods activeley.Dark said:
first off, enemy territory isnt made by gamers, it was supposed to be an official add on for RTCW but the singleplayer didnt meet id softwares quality standards so they didnt publish it, instead of dumping it completeley they made the MP freely available tho.jwer_NL said:
i agreee that the "free" availability of UT added to its success, but i think it was also the fact that it had a lot of new elements, dodging, secondary and even tertiary fire modes and introducing a totally new twist to an old gametype like CTF (xloc).
but if you compare its popularity to Q3 then UT has always been the smaller game, even tho the latter required a CDkey. the secret to this is that the quake franchise managed to take its community to each new issue of the game, something which didnt work with the UT franchise as they refused to listen to the community and made changes too radical for a lot of people.
it is pretty obvious that with 2k3 and 2k4 they wanted to get as many casual gamers (but more importantly buyers) for the game, thats their good right, but people who play a game 4 hours per month and only 3 months long do not make a community. hence the low popularity compared to the most popular online games atm of which all require a CDkey aswell (HL1&2, COD, MOHAA, BF and Q3) the exceptions being AA and ET which basicly got its whole community from RTCW tho which is CDkeyed aswell.
I'we really grown to like the movement in ut2k4 far more than that of ut1. They scared off the ut1ers initially by making such drastic changes to the movement in 2k3. Now they might be doing it again, by limiting the movement too much for the liking of the ut2k4 players...
Well. If Conquest is supposed to be a major battle mod with several armies and huge maps I'd say it heads towards what I expected to find in a 3D shooter but never did find in any other games than strategy.
You know, if you have tried a game like Planetside with maps/servers so big you can be up to 2000 players in a battle at the same time you really miss it somehow. There's a huge basis for lot's of tactics, ingame alliances, squad aranging and even politics. More like a real war. The only problem with PS was that the only real achievements you personally had was your Battle Rang and your Command Rang. You'd end up as a General and then no more goals to head for. But with clans fighting against each other to gain control over continents (big areas), oufits (=clans) performing alliances with each other for one day and the next enemies due to a disagreement, solo players interfearing suddenly etc. was quite an experience. You never knew how the next day was going to end.
I like the speed and efficiency in a 3D shooter like UT (UT99 or 2K4). Now we have teams on 6 players. It gives us some ways to vary the matches from time to time. But bigger maps and bigger teams make it more realistic (if the game is designed for it ofcourse).
And I must agree that when you've played UT for so many years you long to have more strategy in the game, expand it somehow. Maybe Conquest will provide some? I don't know.
You know, if you have tried a game like Planetside with maps/servers so big you can be up to 2000 players in a battle at the same time you really miss it somehow. There's a huge basis for lot's of tactics, ingame alliances, squad aranging and even politics. More like a real war. The only problem with PS was that the only real achievements you personally had was your Battle Rang and your Command Rang. You'd end up as a General and then no more goals to head for. But with clans fighting against each other to gain control over continents (big areas), oufits (=clans) performing alliances with each other for one day and the next enemies due to a disagreement, solo players interfearing suddenly etc. was quite an experience. You never knew how the next day was going to end.
I like the speed and efficiency in a 3D shooter like UT (UT99 or 2K4). Now we have teams on 6 players. It gives us some ways to vary the matches from time to time. But bigger maps and bigger teams make it more realistic (if the game is designed for it ofcourse).
And I must agree that when you've played UT for so many years you long to have more strategy in the game, expand it somehow. Maybe Conquest will provide some? I don't know.
would be sad to see 3rd flop.... Unreal Tournament 2003 was flop number #1... Unreal II was flop number #2...Dark said:
Unreal Tournament 2004 would be really great but gets a half flop point cuz they fucked up Assault...
lets hope next game will be a good one.... like Unreal & Unreal Tournament...
cant be that hard to not make shit?
well if i think about it... Valve makes shit everytime...
and i think you post nothing but shit 
no future itteration of assault will ever be like the AS we play in this league, seems like you didnt understand that yet else you wouldnt reduce ut2k4 on this minor gametype.
unreal 2 was a great game aswell and its bonus XMP probably the biggest innovation in online play in since team fortress and requires a lot more tactical finesse than even AS which is why it was bareley accepted by the online gaming community. judging by your own standards assault as we play it is one of the greatest flops ever btw.
and halflife plus its bonus packs is still one of the best single player games ever, CS, like it or not, is the most successfull game ever and probably quite good if youre able to see behind the blind hatred for tactical games, i havent played hl2 yet but i hear only good about it.
so take your 2 cents elsewhere.
no future itteration of assault will ever be like the AS we play in this league, seems like you didnt understand that yet else you wouldnt reduce ut2k4 on this minor gametype.
unreal 2 was a great game aswell and its bonus XMP probably the biggest innovation in online play in since team fortress and requires a lot more tactical finesse than even AS which is why it was bareley accepted by the online gaming community. judging by your own standards assault as we play it is one of the greatest flops ever btw.
and halflife plus its bonus packs is still one of the best single player games ever, CS, like it or not, is the most successfull game ever and probably quite good if youre able to see behind the blind hatred for tactical games, i havent played hl2 yet but i hear only good about it.
so take your 2 cents elsewhere.
UT2004 is not a flop. It's just not UT99.
Launching in UT99 was fun. RL and Hammer.
Some made an art/science out of it. Lots of funny stuff happened. It was great.
But then again: Did you ever see any army use this technique IRL?
The name says it all: Unreal
UT2004, and probably later versions of UT, will not have these features.
I somehow don't really miss the launches and hammering. Now you're concentrating on tactics and fast creative thinking instead. You try to master your tricky jumps, find ways to sneak around, waiting for the right action at the right time.
If they made hammering and launches posible again it would be ok. But I hardly think it would have the same effect as before due to the new engine and the speed the game has.
There's still plenty of room for fast reactions and person to person close combat in UT2004. You can't finish a map in 3 seconds anymore using launches/jumps. Spam techniques are not posible the same way on most maps like in UT99. Now you have to fight instead, think different.
But I must admit that the super-players with millisecond-thinking + reactions can't p0wn like before. It is not quite posible. Every player has the chance to become a fairly good player if he wishes and do some practise.
You're able to become a good player, indeed, but only with lots of practise
And isn't it what makes the game interesting: Everyone can participate, it just depends on your own efforts?
It is actually quite funny to see public games turn out in total different ways because the team doesn't work tactical together. I've seen teams with really l33t players get p0wned by 'n00bs' because they didn't think strategic. N00bs read the game manual and look in F3. And they go for it.
As Ajax always yelled: DEFEND THE OBJCTIVES ! ! !
Launching in UT99 was fun. RL and Hammer.
Some made an art/science out of it. Lots of funny stuff happened. It was great.
But then again: Did you ever see any army use this technique IRL?
The name says it all: Unreal
UT2004, and probably later versions of UT, will not have these features.
I somehow don't really miss the launches and hammering. Now you're concentrating on tactics and fast creative thinking instead. You try to master your tricky jumps, find ways to sneak around, waiting for the right action at the right time.
If they made hammering and launches posible again it would be ok. But I hardly think it would have the same effect as before due to the new engine and the speed the game has.
There's still plenty of room for fast reactions and person to person close combat in UT2004. You can't finish a map in 3 seconds anymore using launches/jumps. Spam techniques are not posible the same way on most maps like in UT99. Now you have to fight instead, think different.
But I must admit that the super-players with millisecond-thinking + reactions can't p0wn like before. It is not quite posible. Every player has the chance to become a fairly good player if he wishes and do some practise.
You're able to become a good player, indeed, but only with lots of practise
And isn't it what makes the game interesting: Everyone can participate, it just depends on your own efforts?
It is actually quite funny to see public games turn out in total different ways because the team doesn't work tactical together. I've seen teams with really l33t players get p0wned by 'n00bs' because they didn't think strategic. N00bs read the game manual and look in F3. And they go for it.
As Ajax always yelled: DEFEND THE OBJCTIVES ! ! !
I admit I am already bored stiff with ut2k4, playing loads of frag ops on it atm, it's much harder but equally much more involving, you feel like you've really earned a kill when you frag someone mainly because it's so much harder. I also appreciate the fact that it has a much better damage model, a few bullets to the head will take someone down in frag ops, with some guns it's one headshot one kill, shotguns are also pretty much insta kill. There is also far more teamwork in it, you can't just run into a room and clear it out on your own, you have to work in groups, going from room to room all covering each other. It's refreshingly different. Oh and with regards to assault in ut2k4 and the future, all you can hope is that the utr team come up with the goods.
looks pretty, but will suck. before we even start, it's going to suck long and hard, and worse from epic's POV it's going to be another commercial disaster.
Why?
Because of arrogant twats who insist that they know best, like that willhaven muppet who built asthenosphere. They just can't get the clue that DM is not the only game in town.
I have been playing City of Heroes lately, lot of fun MMPORG and thinking... this would be an incredible situation to play an fps in, a huge city with massive terrain... and if anyone other than epic was doing it, I'd be thinking conquest could be amazing. If they would employ people with an ounce of modesty, or who were open to different methods of play, it might be great... but it won't.
To see willhaven laying down the "you WILL play it our way, and you WILL like it", it was delicious to see 2k3 flop so badly... let's not beat about the bush here - 2k3 was a disaster, and 2K4 was responsible for a 50 Million Euro dip in Atari's profits for FY0304.
I hope that they wake up and smell the money, and realise that the users know much, much more about what they want than some pr*ck with an ego the size of willhaven's.
Why?
Because of arrogant twats who insist that they know best, like that willhaven muppet who built asthenosphere. They just can't get the clue that DM is not the only game in town.
I have been playing City of Heroes lately, lot of fun MMPORG and thinking... this would be an incredible situation to play an fps in, a huge city with massive terrain... and if anyone other than epic was doing it, I'd be thinking conquest could be amazing. If they would employ people with an ounce of modesty, or who were open to different methods of play, it might be great... but it won't.
To see willhaven laying down the "you WILL play it our way, and you WILL like it", it was delicious to see 2k3 flop so badly... let's not beat about the bush here - 2k3 was a disaster, and 2K4 was responsible for a 50 Million Euro dip in Atari's profits for FY0304.
I hope that they wake up and smell the money, and realise that the users know much, much more about what they want than some pr*ck with an ego the size of willhaven's.