Third reading for ID cards bill on 18 October 2005

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Cutter

Carbon Allotrope
Oct 8, 2001
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The government's ID cards bill is due for its third reading in parliament tomorrow (18 October 2005). As I don't see many of the Labour MP's voting against their party line, mindless sheep that they are, after a brief delaying action by the Lords which will be overturned either by railroading the bill through with the Parliament Acts or the usual cries of "unelected tory backwoodsmen trying to derail elected government blablabla", it is likely that this travesty of a bill will be passed and its goodbye civil liberties, hello police state...

:(
 
Yet accusing a Tory leadership candidate of snorting coke 20 years ago is so much more relevant to the press. Cocks. I really wish there was some way out of this but I guess we're stuck with it. Latest news on how wank ID cards are? If you're bald the incredibly awesome photo recognition won't work and also if you work in a job where you use your fingers a lot (as a bassist this should hopefully apply to me) then your finger prints will come out wrong. Idiots. Even the people who make the systems admit that they aren't even 90% reliable yet the cockfags who call themselves our government insist on implementing them and wasting huge ammounts of money claming it will stop terrorism and correct every wrong in the country and create world peace. Fucking pricks. Yes this subject gets me angry.
 
Thank goodness I'm not the only one who thinks like that! :D

You just have to love the people who mindlessly repeat the government's line about "If you've got nothing to hide, you've got nothing to fear".

"So, by that logic, they can put government surveillance cameras into your bathroom to watch you take a dump, in your bedroom to watch you shagging, and you'd be OK with that ?" I ask those people. When you put it to them like that, suddenly, they're not so delighted with ID cards...

Oh, remember that Brazillian Kid they shot dead recently, 9 times in the head in the underground? Wasn't it absofuckinglutely amazing how none of the CCTV cameras (there were over 6 of them I believe I read somewhere) in the area at the time were working, or else had "no film" in them?

This flash thing (to the tune of Gilbert & Sullivan's "Modern Major-General") here is absomotherfuckinglutely class:

http://eclectech.co.uk/clarkeidcards.php
 
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I signed up to the no2id pledge site a few months ago, which is about the only proactive thing I have done about the situation to be honest. Most people I have moaned too about it don't seem to care, the majority seem to think that it would stop terrorism.

That flash thing is fantastic indeed, very funny - and I love the dig at EDS. They have screwed up every goverment IT project by billions and not delivered others that have been paid for. I have a relation who works for DWP, is in a quite high position, and yet stupid things like e-mail quotas of 10mb mean that they spend more time doing other things than their jobs. Yet Google mail can offer 2GB to anyone on the Internet. DWP can't even with a £multi billion budget.

Top level IT in this country, outside of the private sector, is in complete chaos and I seriously doubt that a national ID scheme would even be usable before it was obsolete and failed. But I don't fancy us taking the risk in the first place. It's gotta take years and years to issue 60+ million cards to all the UK citizens.

God damn knee jerk reaction to terrorism - still being forced through months later. Not to mention all of the other money which is being wasted on stupid amounts of security which makes nobody safer.
 
And how exactly does having an ID card stop "Terrorism"
It is unbeleivable.

They are going to use the Parliament Act to force this one through arent they? So even if its knocked back at the Lords its inevitable. Even though they have no indication that it will stop terrorism, illegal immigrants or any other made up excuse that they have flaunted so far to justify it.

It will cost a fortune to implement - EDS will overrun in both time and money - it will cost us a small fortune to pay directly for the actual cards never mind the indirectly for the setup of the project. Even if it went all to plan and smoothly installed and worked flawlessly (HA, anyone worked on an IT project for private sector, they always go wrong - add in the government slow moving behemoth and any tiny level of sucess will be a miracle) even if it worked - why Why WHY is it there for anything other than a step towards a police state.

I know other countries have ID cards, and they work fine. However, I am sure that other countries dont have a paranoid farce in power that matches our government.
 
new german id cards will have the face recognition too and we are no longer allowed to smile on id card photos :lol: the recognition will not work.

edit: sorry was a useless fact to you discussion
 
of course you all already have mobile phones which can be used to identify you and where you are already lol:rolleyes:

Rather than the big brother thing I definitely see the main problem as being money. No doubt it will just end up another useless money pit.
 
A policemen/security guard etc won't demand to see your mobile phone to identify you though. It's also possible and legal someone else can use my mobile phone - whereas it will probably be an offense to carry someone elses ID card or not to produce it when its demanded.

The main concern is privacy - perhaps my mobile phone company knows my movement habbits - but the Goverment doesn't - unless they force the mobile phone company to hand it over for each person they request.

Such a system is likely to be abused, will not stop terrorism and will cost tax payers lots of money - as I have already said. It is a completely pointless system, and only one or two companies who produce ID cards will make obscene amounts of profit. And my guess is, the politicans probably have their fingers in these pies to get as much pork as possible.
 
I hate the idea of it.... BUT
I think the big brother thing is inevitable most of us carry mobile phone in a couple of years all our cars will have blackbox technology in them for "insurance" which will monitor the roads we drive on and the speeds we should be going and the speeds we actually do as well as help keep our cars secure and have accurate data in case of a crash.
Most people use their own phones and drive their own cars or company cars that are soley used by them. I know it’s not connected directly to the government NOW but it could be soon. ISP and phone companies have to keep longer records and make them available on request to the government .. It’s only a step away from open access to them..

or am I being paranoid?

Oh, remember that Brazillian Kid they shot dead recently, 9 times in the head in the underground? Wasn't it absofuckinglutely amazing how none of the CCTV cameras (there were over 6 of them I believe I read somewhere) in the area at the time were working, or else had "no film" in them?

I made this exact same point to a friend of mine in a heated discussion not so long back .. I was not passing judgment as to him being a terrorist or associating with known terrorists just the inconsistency of the information that was coming back to public making it look like incompetence and lies.

after the transport bombing and attempts there was cctv footage available from every angle, station, street camera etc tracking the movements of the people responsible on the practice run and the morning of the attacks... then after all that when the security is supposed to have been tighter and people far more vigilant the cctv is out of order or no film...... come on...

or am I being paranoid?

I can only imagine what its like to have to be an armed police man in this situation and knowing someone that does it I know that these guys are not trigger happy morons as they are made out to be by the press and some activist groups, but id rather be told that all the information can not be made transparent due to security then be told a lie that it will be transparent and then be given a feeble excuse.

I understand that the officers that do this part of the job need to be fully backed up for what they do but I also see that when something like this happens and then its fudged by the powers above it dirties the reputation of the people on the ground making them look incompitent.

**Duality** I also have this feeling of showing people how the terrorist were tracked shows the terrorists how to avoid being tracked..... A bit like the Italians going through step by step the methods that they used to track the suspected bomber, that in my opinion was utter stupidity ......

I dunno is it better to accept that someday maybe today we are in a panopticon? that there is a folder on a computer holding the time:date:fequency of my visits to anallesbianvampresseswithstrapons.com that in the same folder there is my phone conversations with 60secondsally on 0898SEXMEUP, atm transactions, creditcard usage and cars whereabouts for the past year and that the government will find that I'm a menace to society and poke me with an umbrella....



Anyway let us see what happens.
 
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It may seem inevitable that these laws are going to come in which reduce our rights - such as black boxes etc. But it doesn't mean we should sit back and take them without apposing them.

I mean ffs, we can't even tag prisoners who are released to ease the pressure on the prison service. IMO, the ID scheme and Pay-As-You-Go taxation on cars are pipe dreams - the capacity to implement such ideas isn't available I don't think.

But saying that, we the people in the UK don't get much of a say when it comes down to major decisions made. We can't change or stop very much - take the anti-war demos as an example. Exactly how many people did need to peacefully protest to stop us going to war? Every single citizen?

And maybe if it had caused violent demonstrations - the message would have been much clearer.

OT now though.
 
i agree we should opose them ..
and its true as you say how many people does it take to stop a war?
how many people does it take to win an election ?

at least after the next election we will have a pisshead or a cokehead running the country..

anyway just to trigger a few of those Mi5 net monitors....

bomb

BOMB

BOMB BOMB BOMB

BOMB BOMB B BOMB BOMB BOMB.

and if you think im not taking this seriously .. you would be very wrong.