mi5 VS (-8-)

[BRaiNRaiN]

READ THIS BEFORE U GONNA REPLY:
I just want mi5/(- squadleaders or Admins to reply on this thread, any other post inculding post with flames will get deleted. So dont even reply when ur just a normal member of mi5 or (- or any other clan!

To our players:
What we've done yesterday was very wrong. We should have left the server as soon as we were told to. What we've done only make things worse than they already were. We should have listened to MyM or Vulc when they said we had to leave the server. I'm very sorry for what i've been doing yesterday and i really acted like a prick. Please forgive me and my clanmates.

To Mi5:
You guys handled better than us. But we've been trying to get u back and see what ur ping was like after it went ok for us. The warmup map was really playable (if you tell it wasnt it's prolly ur ISP, coz i and some other teammates had no lag at all. The next next 2 maps (Ballistic and Riv3AL) werent playable at all.
When Xb and myself asked you guys to come back and test the server, they werent allowed (lenny) or they came in and saw it was playable. Lenny said it exactly like this: If Mc says it's shit, it's shit. That was stubborn. from ur side.. Btw dont tell me that it was server, coz u dont know untill it's been proved.

To Admins:
In my opinion ur not anything different then referees with soccer. Ur task is being impartiatly. When a referee doesnt know the situation he asks the other referees on the sideline (Vulc and MyM in this case). He should ask how it went and if they're really sure that the situation was such a way that there is no other solution. Vulc didnt see the situation such a way that he can decide that it's unplayable, nor did mym coz he left just like mi5 after first 2 maps You havent seen the situation how it was with 12 players. And u havent been trying to get mi5 back to the server. You should think and try to settle the situation before ur gonna decide. Argh it's hard to explain what i mean but i hope you understand it. (This is to the admins in general and not for just 1 admin). I've been acting like a stupid kid yesterday, but most of my words what i've said are the truth and i still think that way.

Solution:
I Hope we can reschedule this match. I prefere to play this match on Server 5 how it was supposed to be. Even it lags, nobody has any advantages. If Mi5 doesnt agree with this I willing to give it a last chance and want to reschedule on any other server. I just want Belt and Joca to agree on this server (pls do coz the difference of your ping on Digifrag or Gameservers is just 20).
If we still cant agree we've a serious problem and i think that might lead in a Big catastrophe within our clan.

Closing Word:
Pls consider this post as negotiation between Mi5 And (- which will hopefully lead into a bright future for both clans. I dont want any problems with any of u. (I've already told mi5 that i had been a prick against some of em. Ive said this a couple of months ago, but some of you didnt believe me at that time and kickbanned me from their channel in quakenet. Hopefully we can settle this now. Please be so kind to help us with a reasonable resolution for both sides. And i hope my striking clanmembers can agree with this solution as well.
If you have any questions regarding this post, please ICQ or mail me: [email protected]

Btw sorry for my bad english!

 

[BRaiNRaiN]

Oh if you dont agree with my solution pls say why and give any other options.. . else we can never solve this

 

[Mughi]

Originally posted by BRaiNRaiN
To Admins:
In my opinion ur not anything different then referees with soccer. Ur task is being impartiatly. When a referee doesnt know the situation he asks the other referees on the sideline (Vulc and MyM in this case). He should ask how it went and if they're really sure that the situation was such a way that there is no other solution. Vulc didnt see the situation such a way that he can decide that it's unplayable, nor did mym coz he left just like mi5 after first 2 maps You havent seen the situation how it was with 12 players. And u havent been trying to get mi5 back to the server. You should think and try to settle the situation before ur gonna decide. Argh it's hard to explain what i mean but i hope you understand it. (This is to the admins in general and not for just 1 admin). I've been acting like a stupid kid yesterday, but most of my words what i've said are the truth and i still think that way.

There was nothing biased in the way it was handled yesterday.
When Dragoonz (I think) said MyM could not speak for the whole clan, I asked who could, and Vulc told me that MyM did speak for the whole clan. So, I have -8- agreeing to a reschedule.

Mc asked me about free league servers as he was looking to move, thinking -8- also wanted to move. There were none, I gave him a list of suitable private servers and he and MyM tried to agree on a server.

It is not our place to insist you carry on when both sides agree that they do not want to. We decided nothing on your behalf.

Our place is to make sure that there is agreement and that is exactly what I got last night. If some members of -8- have a problem with the decision that Vulc and MyM made last night, that is something to be dealt with inside your clan.

There is nothing more impartial anyone can do than follow the wishes of both sides, and when both sides wish to move, there is no bias being shown.

I do not understand where you think impartiality failed last night, please take this up with me in ICQ or PM and let me know.

If there had been disagreement between the two clans everything might well have turned out different, but when both -8- and Mi5 wish to leave that server and carry on elsewhere, what else are we to do? The point of clan leaders is to make decisions on behalf of their entire clan, and they did.

 

[Vulcano]

In my opinion ur not anything different then referees with soccer. Ur task is being impartiatly. When a referee doesnt know the situation he asks the other referees on the sideline (Vulc and MyM in this case). He should ask how it went and if they're really sure that the situation was such a way that there is no other solution. Vulc didnt see the situation such a way that he can decide that it's unplayable, nor did mym coz he left just like mi5 after first 2 maps You havent seen the situation how it was with 12 players. And u havent been trying to get mi5 back to the server. You should think and try to settle the situation before ur gonna decide. Argh it's hard to explain what i mean but i hope you understand it. (This is to the admins in general and not for just 1 admin). I've been acting like a stupid kid yesterday, but most of my words what i've said are the truth and i still think that way.

MyM is one of the clanleaders as well, so he could have spoken for whole clan, bad part from his side was, that he could have agreed with own team before taking action. Clan could have listened anyway, so we could still have a fun war, instead of staying on the server going for 8-0.

From what I saw server was good after those 2 maps, but mym already decided other server, both clans had problem in those maps... Might have been my decision if I was in game, but would have asked own team if they agree first... Wish that happened, then all this shit prolly wouldnt be here...

Edit: Reschedule was 1 of the options last night, but got kicked into the ground by (-, true we got a busy schedule though...

+ the admins did try to get it together again, just not on UTA Server #5, because that was main reason there was another server chosen...
Had contact with both mughi and psy all the time that night, they did whatever they could do as admins.

 

[BRaiNRaiN]

Ok mughi and Vulc... i said someone has been biassed before. That has got nothing to do with this match. I know i said something about it yesterday, but i'm willing to take it back. Insulting one of our clanmembers as an admin is very wrong though. The least thing that person can do is say sorry.
What I still think is that the leagueadmins should first try to negotiate if there's no other option even if both clanleaders have already agreed. You must understand that i've got nothing against u Mughi or any other admin.

 

[Beltroniko]

If both clan leaders hadn't agreed, than admins would also have nothing to say. Game would have followed what was agreed on league site which was server #5, 20:00 GMT.
So whatever was the result/conditions of match admins would have to accept the score.
The whole problem lies on the agreements made outside of the match.

 

[McNeill]

Firstly my only objection to your post is that i recieved no request from -8- to retry the server.
If you mentioned it to lenny, he is not the clan leader and you should have spoken to myself. However i was not in the server on irc at that time if you look.

However if you did ask me, i would accept to retry the server on the basis we restart from 0-0 again were both clan leaders mym and myself left to icq to discuss the server problem. I wouldnt have refused, why? Does it make sense for me to refuse when im constantly asking -8- for a reschedule instead of a default win? And i offer to play on any server that doesnt ping like it did there.

I personally have had no problems with -8- in past, i have found that belt gives me alot of shit behind my back and from irc logs i view after ive played he seems to call Mi5 all arragont and he makes clear to the fact he doesnt like anyone. Even now i have no problems with him, i dont understand his reason's.
Im freinds with alot of members of -8-, sauron, mym, vulcie, brain etc...

I am willing to replay the game anytime which both clans have free, however i dont see the point on playing on server 5, when tbh the first 2 maps ballistic and river 3, you dodged and ended up half way accross the map, this doesnt show a clans skill or have any fun involved...i would prefer server 1/2/4 or a digifrag server.

I only posted here again because brain tried to clam things down between the clans and when this subject is involved im also interested in replying.

kudos to brain/admins and rest of -8- to resolve this situation.

 

[BRaiNRaiN]

The reason I'd like to play on server5 is coz else some people from our clan will say that we're helping u instead of evening the chances on a fair game. But since it seems Beltroniko wont change his mind it can be played on any other server.
But I think some people will never forget me or any clanleader/match arranger of (- if we let you play on any other server than server5

 

[McNeill]

Then thats what you have to decide within the clan , nothing to do with me.

I refuse from this day on to play on server 5 because of the problems yesterday with server and now with -8-.

 

[Nephilim]

(...)To Admins(...)
You should think and try to settle the situation before ur gonna decide.(...)

We have not decided anything on that matter, as its not our job. We are being told by both clans (by the officially entitled people of both clans) what they want to do, tell me 1 reason why we shouldnt do it? It's our job to carry out that decision on their behalf as soon as they both agree to it.

Ok mughi and Vulc... i said someone has been biassed before. That has got nothing to do with this match. I know i said something about it yesterday, but i'm willing to take it back. Insulting one of our clanmembers as an admin is very wrong though. The least thing that person can do is say sorry.

I do not intend this as an offense, but I would appreciate you having the guts and use my name if you speak about me. Anyway, you show me when I have been biased about a decision in the past (I cant be biased just in general, it has to be the case when I do a decision, you know. And the clan you mentioned yesterday (which has fuck all got to do with this topic btw) has never had any decision made about itself, so far). And you show me where I have insulted your clanmate (I take it, X-Bomb in this case?) on that evening.
Then we can talk again. And I'll see if I still consider myself suited for this job I chose to do. But, honestly, I'd like some backing up of your accusations.

 

[MeetYourMaker]

Yesterday:

Warmup was fine
Ballistic, I was first to join the server and first to lag out before everyone had even joined, by the time I had re-enterred they were already attacking the generator. Ping around 300 PL spiking to 50%. Mc asked to find an admin and a possible server change, I left to find an admin with Mc and we spoke on ICQ. In the mean time I was watching UT and Brain said we should stop and Joca said it was impossible to play, I also agreed which means half the team wanted to stop. Rest were asked on TS but no reply.

I spoke to Neph and said server was laggy, he then told me its been acting up recently, always same fault during matches. Due to late start I gave MC a 15 minute window to find a server with me or we reshedule and he agreed, I didnt not want to restart a match past 21:00 due to people like Brain usually having problems playing if matches go on too late. In the mean time I told team on TS that I was looking for a new server, again no response so I try to join server just incase my TS is acting up only to find my spot taken and then get told over TS that DraG has taken it. The fact that the server was fine with 6 or so ppl on it is neither here nor there, it was not fine with 12 ppl on it and the fact that it had been playing up recently meant that if we then decided to play the rest of the match on it and it started acting up again that it would lead to possible flaming from teams finishing when lagging, missing crucial shots etc etc, been there seen that didnt really want to experience it again, not only that but it could delay the match while problems were resolved only to leave us short players as members decided to go to bed later during the match.

Im getting told that only those in the server should make decisions, well maybe if I hadnt been replaced when I sat out for a map while speaking to admins/mi5/server owners or someone had dropped when I said im trying to get back in then I would have been in a better position, who's fault is that? If I hadnt agreed to server change then your right Belt, score would have stood but I play fair and for fun, Mi5/Mc have helped enough in the past when weve had problems with matches but as im the sole match arranger only me, Mc and admins would know that, sometimes its nice to return the favour even if its not in your best interest.

As a clan we have agreed together that we would play for fun, we had considered dropping to HZ but deemed that lame nor fun owning less experienced players, fun does not consist of winning at any cost and I would have hoped that my team would of had that in mind last night.

The only server that I knew both teams wouldnt have a problem with agreeing on last night was unfortunately in use, maybe if that had been free then none of this shit would of arisen.

Im sorry for the amount of grief the admins got over this crap

There would of been a reschedule if I hadnt been too pissed off with my own team to hang around last night and arrange it and as I havent spoken to anyone but Vulc since I cant really say. As server5 has been acting up recently why not play on server4 or P*i both gameservers and as far as I know not had major problems recently.

 

[BRaiNRaiN]

I would show u everything if i could Neph but i dont make any irc logs, so i simply cant. And if you dont know that u've insulted X-Bomb that night you might as well get a new brain or go to an old peoples home.

 

[Nephilim]

I can send you the IRC logs if you want, or I can ask danny if you dont trust me.

However, Im a bit disappointed, I thought this was an attempt of you to "discuss" (word true meaning) the issue properly. But we're back to the flame-level again, and this time around Im not willing to be your frustration-target like I was on that evening.

Point is, you cant accuse me of doing something Im not aware of, all I ask you is to point it out to me. In a polite way (both the asking and the poining out).

 

[BRaiNRaiN]

I'm not trying to flame anyone.. i'm just trying to point out the truth. Oh and btw i gave my opinion of how the admins should handle. I'm not ordering you anything. But i'm sure people have seen the discussion between you and XB. But anyways I think the situation has been handled now.
Please forget this whole match and the discussion afterwards.

[edit] Ok we rescheduled the match! discussion closed [/edit]